Tyre valves

 
 
 
 
 
 
eirebus
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Tyre valves

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Posted: 27.08.2017  ·  #1
Do vans that run on tyre pressures above 60 psi need special heavy duty tyre valves ie. metal bolt on ones or similar , I have heard Ford put these on some heavier Transits ?


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 27.08.2017  ·  #2
The tyre manufacturers recommend them. I got them with my last tyres. They are supposed to be torqued to 4-6 nm, my fitter did not have a torque wrench with settings that low so he just went as far as felt right.


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 27.08.2017  ·  #3
Rubber valve stems are recomended by the manfacturers for car and light van up to 60psi. Metal stems are fitted for above these ,


eirebus
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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 28.08.2017  ·  #4
That's what I was thinking but tyre fitters are putting standard valves in not allowing for higher pressures in heavier vans


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 28.08.2017  ·  #5
Quote by eirebus

That's what I was thinking but tyre fitters are putting standard valves in not allowing for higher pressures in heavier vans


A CRIMINAL ACTIVITY :shock: .

I had a rubber valve go a few years ago while it Italy, San Marino to be precise, when I went to a tyre fitters in Rimini the guy nearly had a heart attack when he saw the other three wheels also had rubber valves fitted.
He changed all four wheels to THESE for a total cost of €60 including re-balancing each wheel.

The MH was originally supplied with standard steel wheels with metal valves but I got Ducato OE alloys from my local FIAT Professional dealer who fitted standard car valves, five years later when I replaced the original tyres the tyre fitters never spotted the valves fitted were unsuitable, about two months later the stem on one of them started to leak, fortunately I had parked up for the night when I heard the mysterious hissing sound, when I checked around the MH one of the rear valved had started to go.
How luck was I that it hadn't gone an hour or so earlier when I travelling at 100km/kh down the motorway.

Up to that time I knew nothing about the subject but quickly became an expert :-)

There are an in-between type of valves, LIKE THESE which are rated to 5.5 Bar but with those there is no safety margin. However, for peace of mind, I would always recommend the type I got in Italy as they are rated away beyond the 5.5 Bar, unlimited in reality.


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 28.08.2017  ·  #6
Thanks Colin is there a number code for the valve type for the particular wheel on the van , This problem has arison out of getting 2 new tyres fitted in Feb which went down slowly , I brought them back and new valves fitted , I then bought another tyre ( after puncture in sidewall ) which went down slowly , new valve fitted this got me thinking its a valve problem but when I asked about it I was told these are the valves we fit to all vans ( not the bolt on type ) . I put 70 psi all round on a 4000 kg Ducato this is well within the tyre rating but I dont think the valves can take it
I noticed your link prices £2.95 for 4 and £14.95 for 4 on motorhome :devil:


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 28.08.2017  ·  #7
Commercial tyres run on steel stems. I am not sure when the pressure rating kicks in. Most tyre companies don't like fitting them because they're difficult to fit on a rusty rim and also the stem are very liable to rust themselves. Also the amount of stems available are as numerous as the stars in the sky, so it leads to balancing issues. I can call in a favour and find out the max pressure rating for rubber stems if you want.


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 28.08.2017  ·  #8
Follow THIS LINK for a full explanation of the three different types of valve and their limitations.
NOTE: reference to 'trucks' in the article means vehicles like the Ford F450 and Dodge Ram for example and not what we call trucks for example HGV's.

The ones fitted to my spare, the original supplied with the MH and the original four steels under it are/were high-pressure metal clamp-in valves, same as those fitted to the OE FIAT Ducato alloys in Rimini.


And for anyone interested CLICK HERE for more reading on the importance of having the correct size valve for the diameter of the valve hole in the wheel and the pressure used in the tyre.


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 28.08.2017  ·  #9
Thanks, Baguette, interesting and informative links, particularly the first.

Davy


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 29.08.2017  ·  #10
Thanks again Colin , you always think of the tyres but never the valves


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 29.08.2017  ·  #11
Round bottom pull in valves have a max cold pressure of 65psi, there is another type with a square bottom that will do 100psi but metal ones would be my choice for MH's. If you fit metal caps (recommended) make sure to use some kind of antiseize on the threads or you could find removal very difficult.


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 29.08.2017  ·  #12
Very informative links Colin.


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 29.08.2017  ·  #13
I rang my local mechanic, tyre dealer this morning. Basically if you wagon is more than 3500kg gross, steel stems are a must. The rsa included this in the last round of road safety measures introduced. If you are over 3500kg and are using rubber stem valves you are liable for a fine and penalty points. Aslo the tyre dealers are also liable for prosecution if they fail to upgrade the stems when fitting or repair a wheel.
The issue for most tyre dealers is they are unsure which steel stem to use to replace a rubber one due to amount of different rims on vans. The hgv are easy because there are only about 5 different stems needed.
Malcolm


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 29.08.2017  ·  #14
Got 4 valves fixed today , some corrosion on the alloy wheels caused by dogs peeing on them :shock: , van passed CVRT in Jan and the RSA were onsite when it was tested :police: thanks all for Info :up:


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 29.08.2017  ·  #15
Quote by eirebus

Got 4 valves fixed today , some corrosion on the alloy wheels caused by dogs peeing on them :shock: , van passed CVRT in Jan and the RSA were onsite when it was tested :police: thanks all for Info :up:


The RSA seem to know F all about Mh's, they're totally messed up confusing them with HGV's and LGV's.

My own has gone through several tests without the rear seat belts and chassis number being checked. They don't seem to know that MH's can have more travel seats than those in the cab or how to find the stamped on chassis number on an A class :sleep:

BTW, The Drum in Disc parking brake system used in the Ducato, which is not much bigger than the drum brake on a Mini and is not intended to act as an emergency brake to bring the vehicle to a halt, is noted to present difficulties in getting past the minimum 'hand brake' or 'emergency brake' efficiency requirements for the test. To get the best possible efficiency reading during a test make the back of the MH as light as possible, take out all the stuff/junk/crap we usually carry around, before the test. The actual axle weight during the test is part of the equation on which the brake efficiency is calculated, so the lighter the axle weight the better the brake test result.
It is also useful to drive a few hundred metres with it gently applied on the way to the test to clear off any rust or corrosion. .


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 30.08.2017  ·  #16
Baguette, you must clean out the drums if your M/H is not used regulary (rust build up) next adjust the little spinner inside the drum to adjust the brake shoes. Then check slack on the rod going to the cables. Then check the Light laden valve lever because if you empty out the weight you are reducing the braking efficiency . I keep mine fully open as these were installed for light vans running empty to prevent the back wheels from locking up. Where as a M/H is nearly at full capacity. I like a little weight on the back to keep them down on the test rollers.


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Re: Tyre valves

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Posted: 30.08.2017  ·  #17
Baguette, it true to a certain extent that the rsa are confused regarding MH.
Traditional a Doe tester had a manual regarding the number of items to checked and how much wear tolerance was allowed. They were allowed to use discretion. However about ten years it started to change with the rsa doing road checks in conjunction with the Garda. These inspections led to the discovery that some of the wear tolerance allowed were too big and the system was overhauled. The newer measuring equipment introduced was also more sensitive to achieve better measurements but a higher failure rate happened because the motor servicers had not up their game.
In recent times the EU created a monster in the vehicle trade called Body type approval. At first the dept of transport wanted the rsa to administer the scheme but the rsa declined to commit and eventually the body type approval was given to the National Standard Authority of Ireland. After all 4 years,the amount of changes the nsai have introduced is mind boggling and there is no let up. The Doe test is now again lacking with new technologies available to vehicle manufacturers.
I work as a truck bodybuilder and there not a week goes by that I don't learn something new and different.
Currently the national vehicle testing programme including all vehicle categories is been thoroughly reviewed with the view of introducing a new regime for early 2019. It is reckoned that every vehicle type will be tested, from a tractor, to a car, to a moped,to a truck, to a mobile crane.
Some proposal that I have heard,
- each vehicle has it own service record, including all repairs and who done it and a plan for future services,
- where possible the engine ecu is plug into and examined for possible tapering and engine efficiency.
- brake disc are to be digitally scaned to access wear, possibly cracking and off balance running.
I seriously hope that the nsai doesn't get the franchise because if they do, our goose is cooked.
But where does this leave motorhomes?
I am led to believe that some MH clubs/councils have participated in the above review and have express a wish to have all MH considered as leisure vehicle, also be considered to drive on a car licence and be tested as under 3500kg.
Malcolm.


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